(;FF[4]
CA[UTF-8]
GM[1]
DT[2020-12-12]
PC[OGS: https://online-go.com/game/29091242]
GN[euro women champ]
PB[begopa]
PW[burdakovadina]
BR[2d]
WR[?]
TM[3600]OT[30 fischer]
RE[W+R]
SZ[19]
KM[6.5]
RU[Japanese]
C[begopa: hi :)
burdakovadina: Have a nice game
begopa: have a nice game
]
;B[pd]
(;W[dp]
(;B[cq]
(;W[dq]
(;B[cp]
(;W[do]
(;B[bn]
(;W[pp]
(;B[dd]
(;W[qf]
(;B[nq]
C[DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: Yo
]
(;W[lq]
C[SbastienGicquel: yo
ben0: [object Object\]
Mbrez: tu commences déjà?
SbastienGicquel: sur twitch je supose
]
(;B[no]
(;W[pn]
(;B[kp]
(;W[lp]
(;B[lo]
(;W[kq]
C[SbastienGicquel: oups mal lu, les yeux encore colé
]
(;B[jp]
(;W[jq]
(;B[ip]
(;W[hq]
(;B[mo]
(;W[nc]
(;B[nd]
(;W[md]
(;B[ne]
(;W[pc]
(;B[qc]
(;W[oc]
(;B[qd]
(;W[qi]
(;B[ph]
(;W[qh]
(;B[pf]
(;W[jc]
(;B[qq]
(;W[pq]
(;B[pr]
(;W[qp]
(;B[rr]
(;W[rq]
(;B[qr]
(;W[pl]
C[Ohnonononono: ohhh gg
Ohnonononono: there is no banner on the site:(
player123987: you have to ask nicely to get a banner
]
(;B[qg]
(;W[rg]
(;B[pg]
(;W[fc]
(;B[cf]
(;W[dc]
(;B[cc]
(;W[cb]
(;B[ec]
(;W[db]
(;B[fd]
(;W[eb]
(;B[ed]
(;W[gc]
(;B[hp]
(;W[gq]
(;B[dm]
C[Mbrez: where do we press the "fight in blood" button
thebestguy: Loser
hitchwigo: use "start a new game" :p
thebestguy: 2 thằng ngu chơi với nhau và 25 thằng cu
Shinkenjoe: i kyu-count around 68 points for white (including komi) and around 22 solid torritory (wihtout the big right side or anyithing in center
]
(;W[dk]
C[thebestguy: 2 idiots play together and 25 do the same
Shinkenjoe: *the left side  (not the right)
]
(;B[ld]
C[player123987: who are the players?
player123987: does anyone know their strenght?
vaurien: Ariane is black
vaurien: 4d
vaurien: Dina Burdakova is white 
usada.hikaru: and vaurine? > are you a female  :)| 
]
(;W[me]
(;B[lc]
C[vaurien: Dina is 5d
]
(;W[mc]
C[vaurien: @usada : doesn't matter ;)
player123987: oh cool this'll be fun to watch
player123987: thanks for th einfo
vaurien: ;)
]
(;B[ke]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: hey everyone
Shinkenjoe: o/
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: aaah, that feeling of "what the fuck" when you enter a dan game and understand nothing x)
Shinkenjoe: i don't believe that
Shinkenjoe: you see white having solid territory and black having potenital and a stone to attack
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: you're right, kyu don't have feelings
player123987: usually amateur dan moves make sense, it's just that you didn't really think about playing there
Shinkenjoe: i don't follow
Maankajo: [object Object\]
vaurien: Yoyo propro
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: hey :)
Maankajo: ((Sorry, that was a misclick, no point there))
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: Maankajo next time pretend you foresaw their moves but your internet was just too slow to send the variation before it happened
Maankajo: Yes, me mighty 19kuy :-D
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: missed opportunity
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: sandbagging smh
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: is L14 ok?
]
(;W[le]
C[player123987: no
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: because of black M15?
player123987: ends the fight right then and there
player123987: [object Object\]
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: white L14
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: that was before the move :p
player123987: ohhh i see
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: yeah poor timing on my part
player123987: sorry i thought you misread 
Shinkenjoe: [object Object\]
player123987: yeah idk this looks pretty sucky
Shinkenjoe: [object Object\]
player123987: [object Object\]
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: I assumed as much but was told "no" so I tried to understand haha
player123987: so you're right so i don't think black would play that hehe
Shinkenjoe: [object Object\]
Shinkenjoe: [object Object\]
블라블라: [object Object\]
]
(;B[kc]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: obv black wishes it not to be so
]
(;W[jd]
(;B[kd]
C[Shinkenjoe: but it did cost a dumpling
]
(;W[kf]
(;B[je]
(;W[lg]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: dango daikazoku o/
Shinkenjoe: is that a soup?
player123987: i could never handle 75 people watching me play
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: not everything is a soup shinshin
player123987: dango is like sweet balls or something idk it's japanese
Shinkenjoe: hmm you could make a soup with dangos then, so im not totally off track
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: it's dumpling
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: much like L16
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: "dango daikazoku" means the great dumpling family, and is a reference to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvzCmV3_12c
player123987: i prefer takoyaki
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: I don't think takoyaki is a shape in Go - it likely is in a popular song but I don't know it
player123987: no i just like fish balls
Ophelion: clannad references in EWGC
Ophelion: what a time to be alive
]
(;B[el]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: takes you back, doesn't it?
player123987: octopus are pretty intelligent 
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: is E8 risky? there's aji on the left with B6 isn't there?
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: hm nevermind, I can't do much more with white than crawl under the corner but not separate
]
(;W[ek]
C[player123987: my back hurts from lying in bed all day
player123987: i think its because i stayed in one position for like 12 hours
Shinkenjoe: so the invasion did cost white around 10 points from my previous count
Shinkenjoe: (black invasion at m 16 i mean
Shinkenjoe: but was worth it 
]
(;B[fk]
(;W[fj]
C[Shinkenjoe: [object Object\]
]
(;B[gj]
C[TomiP: blacks only next move H11
player123987: why
player123987: white hasn't played yet
player123987: what if white goes g9 randomly
]
(;W[gk]
(;B[fl]
(;W[gi]
C[player123987: haa 
player123987: i was right
player123987: get rekt
Shinkenjoe: it wasn't randomly though
player123987: you don't know what went inside her mind
player123987: it could have been an educated random 
Shinkenjoe: yeaah it would be frightening if i did
TomiP: doesn't matter, even now H11 is only move so you get a sweet 5-in-a-row
player123987: you could be here even
]
(;B[hj]
(;W[ei]
C[player123987: 5 in a row only works if it starts from tengen
]
(;B[hi]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: both players suck at gomoku :/
]
(;W[gh]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: ah Ariane won gomoku
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: spoke too soon
player123987: i can't play that game anymore because i keep seeing ataris
]
(;B[hh]
C[player123987: lol finally like 5 moves later h11 is played
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: what hurts the most is the last time I had 5 stones aligned diagonally like this in a game, she passed by and laughed
TomiP: in a very unsophisticated way, I'm not happy
player123987: tender your resignations
ozzyiscimen: [object Object\]
dlpigozzi: ozzy got the whole game
Astroeffort: yea
dlpigozzi: no need to see more
MynameAlex3524443f76c34b3c: Interesting variation
Shinkenjoe: now you can laugh at her back pro
dlpigozzi: B+21.5
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: I disagree ozzy
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: white would capture on move 405
MynameAlex3524443f76c34b3c: In ozzy variation? 
dlpigozzi: yep, 405
dlpigozzi: may be was a misclick
dlpigozzi: we will see
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: a shin jinseo tesuji*
MynameAlex3524443f76c34b3c: Rolf
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: who's rolf?
dlpigozzi: is the father of Dada
idwai01: i14?
player123987: kiss me
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: aaaaah right
Chinitsu: It's a bird
Chinitsu: it's a plane!
dlpigozzi: is superman
dlpigozzi: ways to handle 10 mins moves...
dlpigozzi: probably ozzy was the more fruitful one
dlpigozzi: :P
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: idwai01 I don't know who you want to hurt but the settings don't even allow you to have i in coordinates any more
]
(;W[hg]
C[idwai01: then J after H?
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: yes
MynameAlex3524443f76c34b3c: This hane can be a start of big fight
idwai01: thanks
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: do you not have the coordinates shown?
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: you can fix that in settings
idwai01: only kanji and numbers
Shinkenjoe: is it sente against l16 dumpling
Shinkenjoe: ?
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: ooh makes sense - most people have the letter-number coordinates here, which doesn't show "i" since you don't want to mistake it with l
ozzyiscimen: [object Object\]
]
(;B[gg]
C[idwai01: have fixed it
idwai01: thanks
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: Shinkenjoe, my guess is that's what white hopes, and black is trying to prove that wrong
Chinitsu: idwai01 just ctrl+click on the place you want and it will paste the coordinate into chat
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: or prove that right but not enough compared to an attack on the left side :shrug:
dlpigozzi: f13 or not?
]
(;W[fg]
(;B[gf]
C[idwai01: thank you, Chinitsu
dlpigozzi: seems black has this under control
Chinitsu: hane at the head of L shape doesn't match my proverb database
Shinkenjoe: i vote for c13
dlpigozzi: nice idea
dlpigozzi: still the dumpling if connected is trouble
Chinitsu: J13
dlpigozzi: G15 could work as well
Shinkenjoe: i'j have fear of f12 to play there
]
(;W[ci]
C[dlpigozzi: wow, that was very conservative
dlpigozzi: but efficient
idwai01: K14
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: or J13?
Shinkenjoe: then white gets out sente, maybe the goal of c11
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: gote is beauty
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: works better in French
Shinkenjoe: so black o8 to thwart the plan
grp: c7
arkan: What on F12?
]
(;B[dh]
(;W[di]
C[Chinitsu: ooh
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: black wants blood and won't stop until she gets some
Shinkenjoe: [object Object\]
Shinkenjoe: blood or sente
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: there's a difference?
Shinkenjoe: blood is when you kill the group, sente is when you don't
]
(;B[ig]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: sente means you go for blood elsewhere
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: it's not just local blood
grp: lol
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: global blood as it were
Chinitsu: J13 was so important. Allowing black play J13 mean white's H13 was a big mistake. white basically helped black get half a ponuki
Shinkenjoe: yeah , im just a local boy, this globalization  thnig is over my head
dlpigozzi: [object Object\]
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: white gets J15 sente to close the top though, right?
DenisK: [object Object\]
Shinkenjoe: i think cinitsu is right, and that white realized that when playing c11
grp: was it possible to play h15 after c11?
Shinkenjoe: as who?
grp: h13 not c11 sorry
NeonLights: that ladder looks good enough for Jehovah
grp: for white
Shinkenjoe: [object Object\]
grp: yep
]
(;W[lj]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: risky for the left isn't it?
Shinkenjoe: many things to think through
Shinkenjoe: [object Object\]
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: [object Object\]
Shinkenjoe: i thought about m9 to m8 instead of m10
]
(;B[lk]
C[mt3000: Дина, вперед!!!
DenisK: [object Object\]
DenisK: Blanc peut jouer comme ça j'imagine
]
(;W[mk]
C[DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: ok
NeonLights: is L9 too boring?
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: might be a lil submissive
]
(;B[kk]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: I said "might" nobody throw rocks at me please
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: *throw a rock*
Chinitsu: *shame*
Chinitsu: *shame*
Chinitsu: *shame*
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: D:
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: *throw a tomato*
NeonLights: black doesn't really need anything risky at this stage right
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: thanks I needed a tomato
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: doesn't she? it's not like there's an overabundance of points
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: s14 huge
Chinitsu: Oh is this still EGWC or another tournament?
lorro: EGWC
Chinitsu: I don't see Koba bombarding tour info like usual
lorro: 1/4 final
Chinitsu: I see thanks
Shinkenjoe: it's 13,00 at a saturday, he's asleep
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: it's a kyu counting but I think whie's ahead by (sente and) komi
NeonLights: I have the feeling that black has all the big plays right now
Chinitsu: I think so too and that lead me to question M9
Chinitsu: (I meant I agree with prosody)
Shinkenjoe: how many points did you get for white (or black?)
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: G5 for white reduces nicely no?
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: I'm not clear on the minutiae of what I should count for either but I'm at about 26 for both, give or take a couple
]
(;W[re]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: assuming worst yose for each count
dlpigozzi: white has definitely good cash
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: huge
dlpigozzi: bottom are left are a lot of points
dlpigozzi: bottom and right*
Chinitsu: 🤪
Chinitsu: oh looks like you can do emoji in chat
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: emoji broke this site once Chinitsu are you sure you want to risk it?
💖 KoBa 💖: hello
Chinitsu: Really? Must be last millenia's story
💖 KoBa 💖: hehe looks like i only missed the first 100 moves here ^^
dlpigozzi: good morning koba
]
(;B[qe]
C[💖 KoBa 💖: so whats happening here, looks like an even game
Chinitsu: Hi Koba how was noon nap?
]
(;W[rf]
C[Shinkenjoe: count and reassess
💖 KoBa 💖: it was quite good chini ^^
Chinitsu: :p
]
(;B[mh]
C[NeonLights:  the extended pause after the atari-connect is always somewhat ominous
💖 KoBa 💖: i count  roughly 50 points for both ^^
]
(;W[mg]
C[dlpigozzi: then the komi gives it to white
]
(;B[ng]
C[DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: yose not over yet
💖 KoBa 💖: lol middle-game isnt over yet xD
dlpigozzi: yeso gets reduced and no big groups with threats
dlpigozzi: yose*
💖 KoBa 💖: there is always yose, but thats not important rn
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: I mean
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: it's early yose
💖 KoBa 💖: important is having these groups around o13 without guaranteed life ^^
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: unless N13 dies but I don't see that happening
dlpigozzi: G6 area probably will be crutial for points
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: or R17 but I don't see that either
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: yeah white just has to play G5 and it's a safe and big reduction
]
(;W[nj]
C[Shinkenjoe: i count lick 56 white 52 black (including komi)
💖 KoBa 💖: f12 cut is kinda nasty for white
💖 KoBa 💖: oh wow, your counting is so much more accurate than mine
Shinkenjoe: but i counted favourably for black
Shinkenjoe: why ? we don't know the real count
Shinkenjoe: im plus minus 10 usually on my counts, but here it should be closer
Chad Thunderredacted: who is winning
Chad Thunderredacted: ?
Chinitsu: I think white is winning by a bit, but it depends largely on how this fight resolve. Seems a bit complicated for me point-wise
💖 KoBa 💖: i wanna say white, but its really close
]
(;B[lh]
(;W[kh]
(;B[ki]
C[Chad Thunderredacted: looks like it was going really well for white until the turn 76 sequence
]
(;W[qb]
C[Chad Thunderredacted: now its more even
]
(;B[rb]
C[Bas: I would say white has a little bit more territory, but now it must live in gote?!
]
(;W[pa]
C[NeonLights: France is clearly going to win
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: as usual
Shinkenjoe: is black alive after white lives?
]
(;B[jh]
C[Chinitsu: yes but in gote as I'm reading
]
(;W[kg]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: black is connected
Chad Thunderredacted: black must play a move to connect?
Chinitsu: that's the question that black must answer hehe
Chinitsu: I think if black must play gote here then it's likely white won
💖 KoBa 💖: hmm i think it is unkillable now
💖 KoBa 💖: w has to start by cutting m11
💖 KoBa 💖: and then b could make life
Chinitsu: or maybe black is thinking about how to kill white :D
Chad Thunderredacted: where is the next big move if it is gote for black?
]
(;B[li]
C[player123987: meant for someone else but not for me
💖 KoBa 💖: s4 c16 are big, but miai xD
💖 KoBa 💖: f12 looks good cut for b
]
(;W[cd]
C[player123987: love was out to get me that's the way it seemed. disappointment haunted all my dreams
]
(;B[bc]
(;W[bd]
(;B[be]
(;W[bb]
C[Chinitsu: if you compare s4 and c16 then it's obvious that c16 is bigger Koba xD
NeonLights: are you serious, quoting ABC 40 years after the fact
Shinkenjoe: c16 cas third line
Chinitsu: it's 3rd line vs 2nd line
💖 KoBa 💖: hehe right
]
(;B[ce]
C[💖 KoBa 💖: indeed
]
(;W[ac]
C[dlpigozzi: white G5 black F5, very big both
]
(;B[ch]
C[Shinkenjoe: this look more and more white
]
(;W[eh]
(;B[ra]
(;W[rd]
(;B[rc]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: maybe black F4 better than F5, since F5 is just gote. F4 lets white push, but it ends with black closing in sente
]
(;W[ie]
(;B[jf]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: hmm no G5 is also an issue if black F4
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: nvm
]
(;W[mf]
(;B[mb]
(;W[nb]
(;B[jb]
(;W[ib]
C[Chinitsu: [object Object\]
Shinkenjoe: mee i have to leave :(
]
(;B[ka]
C[Chinitsu: eh?
Chinitsu: eeeeh?
NeonLights: c'est un peu macron maintenant pour noir
Chinitsu: why tiger's mouth?
💖 KoBa 💖: its good move, no?
💖 KoBa 💖: m18 does not work
Chinitsu: [object Object\]
Rocco: White was alive anyway?
]
(;W[fo]
C[Chinitsu: oh right I was an idiot lol
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: white is just getting all the good yose
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: rip
]
(;B[gn]
C[EnigmaVr: Q18?
]
(;W[go]
(;B[hn]
C[Rocco: White is alive, only ko threats.
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: EnigmaVr: doesn't work because of M18
]
(;W[ho]
(;B[io]
C[Rocco: Not even 
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: c2
Rocco: Just take at P18
EnigmaVr: oh yes
EnigmaVr: M18 first
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: [object Object\]
Chinitsu: [object Object\]
]
(;W[ll]
C[Shinkenjoe: white wouldn plad 2
]
(;B[oj]
C[DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: [object Object\]
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: w does'nt need m18 now
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: that's literally your second move in the variation, I'd call that "needing it"
Rocco: You definitely need it
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc:  just respond to "m18 frst"
Rocco: But if you start with P18
Rocco: you get a stone
Rocco: in the other variation he can capture R18 right?
Rocco: Meh, they both seem equivalengt.
Rocco: equivalent.
]
(;W[ok]
(;B[pj]
C[NeonLights: white understands
]
(;W[qj]
(;B[pk]
(;W[qk]
C[Chinitsu: mmm
Chinitsu: what is this
]
(;B[ol]
(;W[om]
C[💖 KoBa 💖: ohh
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: there's colour everywhere
💖 KoBa 💖: well this is a cut
Chinitsu: oh it's not that severe
EnigmaVr: w ok
]
(;B[nk]
(;W[nl]
(;B[ok]
(;W[mm]
(;B[dr]
(;W[er]
(;B[cr]
C[💖 KoBa 💖: ah :/
Chinitsu: mmm?
💖 KoBa 💖: it looked more violent than it was >___>
]
(;W[fq]
C[Chinitsu: [object Object\]
Chinitsu: ah nvm, not that interesting
]
(;B[kl]
(;W[km]
(;B[jm]
C[prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: a few points
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: s4
Rocco: left side looks huge?
]
(;W[ni]
C[Chinitsu: huge for whom?
]
(;B[oh]
C[Rocco: both I think
Rocco: C9 ?
Rocco: dunno
]
(;W[nf]
C[Rocco: C8*
]
(;B[nh]
(;W[oe]
(;B[od]
(;W[of]
(;B[pe]
C[Rocco: S4 bigger though 
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: S4 is gote for both
]
(;W[ic]
C[Chinitsu: B8 bigger than S4 I think?
]
(;B[fh]
C[Rocco: yeah, B8 was the other option
]
(;W[fi]
C[Chinitsu: because B8 is sente
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: couldn't black even go for B9?
]
(;B[gd]
C[Rocco: S4 for black sets up another sente exchange, not sure its gote
]
(;W[if]
C[Chinitsu: the follow sente exchange will be added to the move value
Rocco: [object Object\]
Chinitsu: you basically consider it guaranteed benefit of the move
]
(;B[jg]
(;W[bh]
C[Rocco: it looks huge to me
]
(;B[bg]
(;W[dg]
(;B[cg]
(;W[bi]
(;B[ef]
C[💖 KoBa 💖: SE thinks w+0.5 ^^
]
(;W[eg]
C[begopa: thanks
burdakovadina: thank you
Chinitsu: [object Object\]
fightyoats: gg
💖 KoBa 💖: oh gg!
prosody 最初頭に浮かぶ一手: good game!
Chinitsu: anyway S4 is 7+4/2 = 5.5point
robertmehl: Gg
FeiWang: gg
💖 KoBa 💖: oh wow how on earth it was 20 point lead?
Shinkenjoe: gg
Shinkenjoe: thx to the players
]
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