(;FF[4]
CA[UTF-8]
GM[1]
DT[2021-01-28]
PC[OGS: https://online-go.com/game/30543987]
GN[Grand Prix Final]
PB[Palko]
PW[roln90]
BR[1d]
WR[2d]
TM[2700]OT[20 fischer]
RE[W+R]
SZ[19]
KM[6.5]
RU[Japanese]
C[Palko: have a nice game
roln90: have a nice game
]
;B[qc]
(;W[dp]
(;B[cq]
C[ys3: this will be fun
]
(;W[dq]
(;B[cp]
(;W[do]
(;B[bn]
(;W[dd]
(;B[cc]
C[notGood justOk: palo ideeeš
]
(;W[dc]
(;B[cd]
C[notGood justOk: do toho!
]
(;W[de]
C[carrootjazz: this match play is only ogs or another place
]
(;B[ce]
(;W[cf]
(;B[bf]
(;W[qp]
C[Whirly: it's on oga dirextly
ys3: just here but review probably streams on twitch
Whirly: directly
ys3: both are at computer play on OGS
carrootjazz: thx whirly
]
(;B[nq]
C[ys3: ill give palko 10 bucks if he plays 3-3 right now
ys3: oh
xiaodaiboy: woohoo
]
(;W[lq]
C[mcpudding: what kind of match is this, a finals, are there brackets somewhere?
Lennonson: Semifinal if the Grand Prix.
]
(;B[qq]
(;W[pq]
(;B[pp]
C[ys3: https://www.eurogofed.org/grandprix/egpf2020.html
]
(;W[qr]
C[mcpudding: ty
]
(;B[rq]
(;W[op]
C[-Sai_: I am by your side
]
(;B[po]
(;W[oq]
(;B[rr]
(;W[on]
(;B[oo]
(;W[no]
(;B[qo]
(;W[np]
C[ys3: 32 moves in, palko has all 4 corners as he wants. now what
awaytoplay: now ko
B2 Bomber: white's influence is a bit scary
awaytoplay: a framework without a corner is never scary
awaytoplay: [object Object\]
awaytoplay: hard to make lots of points when you need to surround from all sides
ys3: theres a lot of open space down there, its more likely b will be able to attack d4 stones than for w to build a big framework down there
]
(;B[hp]
C[Whirly: not vwry likely actually that w will get attacked
]
(;W[hn]
C[mcpudding: so this is the deciding game for them
mcpudding: the winner of this game proceeds to the finals
Goran33: Илья, держи строй!
ys3: not very, but still more likely than w getting too many points down there
]
(;B[fo]
(;W[cn]
(;B[fq]
C[kusrabs: https://online-go.com/player/700472/Goran33 , ))) Про себя он отметил "Есть, т-щ Горан!" Но вслух не может, камера
]
(;W[bm]
C[kusrabs: Who can explain, why Shikshi plays white again? 
]
(;B[bo]
C[dlpigozzi: I think it was decided by nigiri
]
(;W[cr]
C[awaytoplay: ogs "nigiri"?
]
(;B[br]
(;W[dr]
C[awaytoplay: ogs "automatic" color is not random, the stronger player always gets white
awaytoplay: whats worse - this is the default setting
ys3: they both switched colors in first two games, i dont know how they do it for third game
B2 Bomber: there's random setting too
dlpigozzi: really?
]
(;B[cm]
(;W[bl]
C[ys3: black won both games so far
B2 Bomber: makes sense that the weaker player takes black
Whirly: no it doesnt
awaytoplay: it does not make sense to be a default setting
Whirly: it ian't handi
awaytoplay: especially when you define "no handicap"
errno_h: that is why we have komi
]
(;B[dm]
(;W[bs]
C[Celebrir: If you have to choose a set color for "automatic" it makes sense, What you describe is 'random" and something entirely different I think
dlpigozzi: so, the tournament page says nigiri for all games except best of three
B2 Bomber: random=nigiri
dlpigozzi: some tsumego, is it alive?
liquid: c9?
dlpigozzi: white pushing sente
cephm: I think it's a capturing race now
Goyer: interesting - B took 4 corners, according to the proverb - they gonna lose now?:)
]
(;B[aq]
C[ys3: in andrii and siasio's best of 3 they switched colors for game 1 and 2 then game 3 colors was same as game 1. this one, colors same as game 2. maybe the y nigiri game 3
awaytoplay: did palko find a ko here?
]
(;W[bp]
(;B[ck]
(;W[co]
(;B[bq]
(;W[bk]
(;B[cj]
(;W[bj]
C[awaytoplay: hm, just death
godevilgo1: Game over?
ys3: better to die like this anyway i think
dlpigozzi: did u see yesterdays? palko was also dead in top right and then...
awaytoplay: [object Object\]
]
(;B[bi]
(;W[ci]
C[errno_h: he just swap corner territory and outside influence
]
(;B[bh]
(;W[cg]
C[dlpigozzi: thin influence right now
ys3: still better result than making tiny life
awaytoplay: yes
awaytoplay: whit might choose ko
dlpigozzi: H6 M3 make it not so good in my opinion
ys3: well if he lives in corner he still has those moves but hes weaker on the outside
dlpigozzi: and W won also 20 mins
ys3: white still has those moves but white is weaker i mean
ys3: but black is weaker*
ys3: cant type lately...
]
(;B[cl]
(;W[an]
(;B[ap]
C[B2 Bomber: looks good for black
terepy: he gets at least 5 ko threats from that corner, how much is that worth?
cephm: double ko ?
awaytoplay: so - where is white's ko threat?
timuzhti: I think it's usually called a two step ko.
cephm: A7 and A1 ?
]
(;W[bg]
C[hallucinogenia: ko potential on both sides
]
(;B[ch]
(;W[am]
(;B[ao]
C[zion153: a2?
xiaodaiboy: meh
xiaodaiboy: looks terrible for black
hallucinogenia: "always start the ko"
notGood justOk: black wins?
cephm: must start a ko now
aesalon: looks rough for white
]
(;W[be]
C[awaytoplay: no threat
awaytoplay: black cannot kill white in 1 move
aesalon: ah good point. always miss that
awaytoplay: this is an approach ko for black
SteamboatGoat: look at all those stones on the second line - glorious
terepy: what does white do if black a10?
awaytoplay: locally a10 a2
dlpigozzi: a2
林峻希: [object Object\]
Yvmores: I left for 20 minutes. I did not expect the game to develop this way
awaytoplay: but white has no threat, so w probably tenuki
awaytoplay: or
kusrabs: Yes, it's so low. But if believe Kata, it's even
terepy: tenuki until they can make a ko threat?
]
(;B[kq]
C[Welvang: [object Object\]
kusrabs: a2 wins and crashes black
kusrabs: https://online-go.com/player/28147/Welvang , twitch?
ozzyiscimen: good game
awaytoplay: hm
]
(;W[jq]
C[hypergeometric: shouldn't W plays immediately the ko ? the more W waits and the biggest the loss will be at the ko 
awaytoplay: too complicated for me
Welvang: thats too complicated for a 9am game
kusrabs: a10 wins and crashes white... What the semifinal )))
dlpigozzi: hahaa
terepy: I don't understand why they both tenuki? black seems to get the whole corner via a10, and white gets the corner with a2?
zion153: [object Object\]
ys3: if white wants to lose the ko for his non-existent ko threat, sure
Welvang: i'll drink some coffee and we start the stream :)
]
(;B[kp]
C[dlpigozzi: c18, not good enough?
SteamboatGoat: very cool, thanks welvang!
liquid: indeed what are they thinking
]
(;W[kr]
(;B[jp]
(;W[ir]
C[kusrabs: In Moscow it's 11:42, not that early
ys3: ilya thinks its too early for this too, he has more time than he  started with
dlpigozzi: here we go, ko threats everywhere
clywzach: i dont want to think about this board lol
hypergeometric: Wow I feel nice being 6k :) that global increase was nice 
awaytoplay: white does not want to play the first move, because that makes it a direct ko for black
awaytoplay: and black does not want to play the first move because it is only an approach ko
hypergeometric: My go teacher went from 4d to 9d+ 
liquid: it is just rankings
]
(;B[iq]
(;W[jr]
(;B[hr]
C[kusrabs: https://online-go.com/player/487603/hypergeometric , I feel bad... I was 12k yesterday, what if I try to play REAL 7k?
zion153: Can black play m4?
BoykoGoranov: what do you mean real 7k? there's no such thing anymore
BoykoGoranov: those 7ks are now 2-3k
liquid: difference between kyu players are small
kusrabs: now white must start a ko
liquid: dont overthink it
BHydden: what makes you think you were a "real" 12k before?
Txipa: lol
]
(;W[go]
C[hypergeometric: kusrabs : how do you do this ? the @user
terepy: [object Object\]
kusrabs: https://online-go.com/player/487603/hypergeometric , copy by right mouse the link on players name
hypergeometric: well I thought the same and I just won twice again a 8k, you have to convince yourself the actual 7k are the 11k previously 
Lennonson: Isn't this exactly what Pavilion wants? No solid territory for White, or little, and steadily negating the center influence?
hypergeometric: (actually lost once because of timeout :( )
timuzhti: Or turn off visible ranks for a few games.
Lennonson: *Pavol 
hypergeometric: https://online-go.com/player/487603/hypergeometric test
hypergeometric: oh
zion153: [object Object\]
hypergeometric: https://online-go.com/player/431153/kusrabs thank you. Want to play a game after ? :D
]
(;B[fp]
(;W[io]
(;B[ip]
C[dlpigozzi: solid no ko shape
kusrabs: https://online-go.com/player/487603/hypergeometric , yes, sure
marcjegoupro: e6? white ?
marcjegoupro: game is over?
kuvalda: https://online-go.com/player/487603/hypergeometric Let's play now ) I was 7k yesterday. Let's test if there's any difference )
awaytoplay: e6 is a hole that makes it even more awkward for black to win the ko, because half of the group can still run away
]
(;W[en]
C[marcjegoupro: for sure awaytoplay
]
(;B[gm]
C[ys3: you just said it was game over though
kusrabs: a2 still ok for white. He sees it, I'm sure. But keeps for better times?
Welvang: stream has started, I will start very soon 
Welvang: https://www.twitch.tv/europeangofederation
SteamboatGoat: yay
marcjegoupro: the game continue but difficult now for black
terepy: f6?
Lennonson: Thanks Tanguy!
]
(;W[fl]
C[ys3: is it difficult for black?
SteamboatGoat: meanwhile, on the top right corner, a lone R17 stone sits and waits 
clywzach: lol r17 just watching this all play out from afar 
hallucinogenia: sabaki? c7 group for g5?
SteamboatGoat: "at least I'm safe"
BHydden: famous last words
ys3: [object Object\]
death_taxes: very weird looking board
awaytoplay: R17 practicing social distancing
death_taxes: :p
zion153: BB
]
(;B[hm]
C[ManyBears: always keep a two-space distance
]
(;W[fn]
C[林峻希: [object Object\]
]
(;B[gn]
C[clywzach: i would also social distance from those stones
awaytoplay: but this often happens in 3-3 games
SteamboatGoat: 3-3 makes a corner relatively uninteresting to approach or extend from
awaytoplay: black can add another stone to that corner, but almost any other corner stone looks slightly more efficient when adding a 2nd stone
death_taxes: so, why doesn't somebody start the ko already?
SteamboatGoat: suspense
ys3: why would either side want to start it
marcjegoupro: white connect E8 ?
dlpigozzi: AI thinks B missed F6 and lost 6 points
death_taxes: b can just A10, right?
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: Hi 
marcjegoupro: yes
clywzach: hi
kusrabs: https://online-go.com/player/766746/dlpigozzi , what program do you use? 
notGood justOk: no need  A10 now
awaytoplay: black can a10, but only if he plans to win the a2 ko
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: hum, tough game
awaytoplay: without a10 white needs 2 moves to kill black, a2 and b4
awaytoplay: after a10 white still needs 2 moves, a2 and b4
marcjegoupro: but ko
terepy: are there any ko threats on the board?
awaytoplay: if black plays a10 and loses the ko then a10 is a pass
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: is the team "game over" still here and ready to announce the victory by resignation ? lol
dlpigozzi: anyway, without a10 white is fine and now even the D4 group escaped 
marcjegoupro: is there any issue
]
(;W[fi]
C[DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: Go is an issue
notGood justOk: F7?
hallucinogenia: hurts d7?
]
(;B[hk]
C[dlpigozzi: D11 now?
dlpigozzi: another 3 stones sac
ys3: i would think d11 invites a10
dlpigozzi: it does of course
awaytoplay: [object Object\]
ys3: which of course a10 forced w to start the ko, which b will win and d11 becomes a pass
dlpigozzi: [object Object\]
awaytoplay: ooh
ys3: [object Object\]
awaytoplay: [object Object\]
Sadiker: [object Object\]
ys3: isnt it the same?
awaytoplay: but a9 looks prettier
ys3: yeah true. gotta be pretty
dlpigozzi: AI goes for A2 now
dlpigozzi: this is a perfect example of difference in play
dlpigozzi: I dont think W will never start it
hallucinogenia: but what's the ai's ko threat?
ys3: ai can misplay that stuff sometimes
awaytoplay: winning the ko is quite big for white
awaytoplay: because of C11
Puumanamana: no need for ko threats, right? a2 and then connect at c2
awaytoplay: but not easy to start the ko without local threats
dlpigozzi: AI thinks black gets N3 and W captures all
aesalon: every entity can misplay ko
dlpigozzi: [object Object\]
aesalon: how bad was F11
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: [object Object\]
dlpigozzi: basically exchange the corner for the bottom
aesalon: no chance that is good
dacat1: ^^
dlpigozzi: Ilya 10 mins move... something coming
dacat1: wait I got promoted... I did nothing and got promoted
ys3: ali said that pavol and ilya played the same game last year in pro league up to f5
dacat1: ogs pulling a reverse kgs
ys3: pavol had played f3 instead of f5 in that game
]
(;W[im]
C[ys3: probably why it went so fast
JanGret: that is the rank recalculation that was done tonight
JanGret: most dan players got 1 or 2 ranks
awaytoplay: veggie lost 3 ranks
ys3: he probably benefitted from the glitch they were fixing then
JanGret: and as a ddk I got 5 ranks... (while still feeling like I should be a 22k)
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: pavol needs to be carefull with the time management
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: Rank recalculation also broke rank restriction in games though.
АндрейКим: Why palko dont play f 7 now?
]
(;B[di]
C[ys3: yeah, theyre looking into it i think
ys3: it seems like there could be some cache issues
Vlad Dotsenko: > Why palko dont play f 7 now?
alphaseek: A2 ko?
Vlad Dotsenko: That will make him loose G7 figure
Vlad Dotsenko: Or at least will be senseless 
awaytoplay: [object Object\]
Vlad Dotsenko: +
Vlad Dotsenko: [object Object\]
АндрейКим: Vlad you re right. 
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: Isn't d11 forcing W to start the ko at A2?
Ghets: You mean to tell me roln90 didn't play symmetrically again?
АндрейКим: Baut he could hit there earlier
ys3: [object Object\]
Jakov1: is ko in corner
dacat1: nice @ys3
dacat1: hmmm this position is too confusing
dacat1: white got something nice in the top right corner, b13 and b15 are solid money
joris104: Don't say that, we're the ones who are supposed to be confused while you explain, dacat
dacat1: I'm the one who's supposed to be ever so slightly less confused
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: You mean top left corner?
林峻希: [object Object\]
ys3: tanguy was talking about playing with ilya, tha tilya is really good at finding th ebest move, the AI move, so best way to fight that is to throw in something overplay-ish and it can throw someone like that off
dacat1: so... white's profit so far is the extra moves on the *top left corner...
dacat1: black's pofit is a ponnuki/wall on the outside which means he's generally in control of the fight
dacat1: barely in control
dacat1: but in control nonetheless
]
(;W[ar]
(;B[as]
C[hallucinogenia: here we go
]
(;W[cs]
C[ys3: decided he had to
dacat1: and the ko is this nuclear explosion waiting to happen
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: And so it begins.
ys3: then a10 then white has something in mind
Jakov1: o uh
Chinitsu: I still think ko  seems pretty good for black tbh
dacat1: im very unsure of whether white should have wasted a move here
dacat1: he still needs two more to actually do anything
]
(;B[fk]
C[OndraKruml: feels good for w
hallucinogenia: mm, this cancels h8
dacat1: i would have played c18 probably and waited ^^,
dacat1: good for w? 
Ten: Black looks totally robbed
joris104: How do you even start estimating wether this ko is good for black or white ?
dacat1: yh i guess this is fine
]
(;W[ek]
C[OndraKruml: feeling :D
Ghets: Robbed? In what sense?
dacat1: but what if white played c18 to keep the corner
dacat1: to rob black even more
dacat1: :D
]
(;B[fj]
C[awaytoplay: [object Object\]
]
(;W[ej]
C[dacat1: he can still live the corner
dacat1: but yes it's a huge payment 
BHydden: can black's c10 stones live?
]
(;B[ei]
C[ys3: itd be more surprising if they didnt
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: Depends. Without killing anything and without escaping?
]
(;W[el]
C[Jakov1: bambo join
dacat1: [object Object\]
You in mid air: b needs 3 ndi from w
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: What's ndi?
You in mid air: handi
ys3: must have been weird when b won yesterday then
ys3: without handicap
]
(;B[fh]
C[You in mid air: well that happens once in a while
]
(;W[gi]
C[Badukness05: lucky
]
(;B[hj]
(;W[hi]
C[Аlрhа - 1 5 2: Isn't "lucky" offensive term in logical games?
Free Tibet: "game" is an offensive term for the art of Go
OndraKruml: only if you are pretencious
You in mid air: proffessional players might take it offensively, yet lucky is lucky
ys3: well you sat there and claims pavol needs 3 handicap against ilya
mcpudding: well game is not really offensive, the EGF uses the term as well
ys3: thats more offensive than anyhting said here so far
You in mid air: my 3 handi comment was of course a hyperbole, i am simply saying b should resign this game
]
(;B[bd]
(;W[af]
(;B[db]
C[OndraKruml: very strict mid air :D for sure b can still play
ys3: tanguy and other dont understand most the middle moves, thinks that bottom left ko was messing with the players a lot
Ten: Like ’these guys don’t know anything’?
You in mid air: w needs to play e13 now
ys3: saying that they were playing a lot of dame in the middle and stuff
ys3: and wasted moves. up to j7
tekken8: does e13 work?
]
(;W[eb]
C[ys3: d11 too
]
(;B[bb]
C[ys3: they jst like "come on play the ko already"
]
(;W[eg]
(;B[eh]
C[OndraKruml: Id say ppl that are here and dont follow the stream arent really interested  about the stream and want to form their own opinion
ys3: its better than AI spam though
hypergeometric: Why not W take the ko now ? 
hypergeometric: I guess W will wait B A10 
Zaphodian: I follow both and occasionally listen to those guys. They are pretty good, actually. 
BoykoGoranov: hypergeometric - why take the ko, that group is dead
]
(;W[hg]
C[BoykoGoranov: white is trying to kill the mid left group now
ys3: peopl start getting curious and pull up AI then post it in here, better to nip it in the bud so it doesnt happen
Saycho: hello
Badukness05: hi
]
(;B[ef]
C[gray1892: any obvious for h13 over g13?
gray1892: obvious reason*
You in mid air: e14 is a good move
BoykoGoranov: more space if white starts pushing up?
ys3: also b2 isnt dead yet
Ten: This chat is starting to remind me of the old KGS, before the AI came around of course
BoykoGoranov: black is trying to push and atari 
mcpudding: i guess bottom left ko is just theoretical, white simply has to take the group and minize the cost to do so, i see no other option now
ys3: i miss it, ten. it dont happen anymore
Badukness05: ogs will be the new kgs, just need autoritah administers banning all
martin97: G13 F13 F14 E14 F15 D13 D14 D10 and b is alive at least
]
(;W[ff]
C[Ten: I fear we have lost a lot of the art of kibitz in the past few years, there’s no torriroty-level comments anymore
gray1892: thanks!
]
(;B[dg]
C[martin97: and when b will live anyway h13 is better shape and there is no cut left
]
(;W[df]
(;B[fg]
(;W[fe]
C[ys3: and w doesnt want to leave any big ko threats
martin97: who is torriroty?
OndraKruml: the ko bot left seems to play an important role here :D
Roquefort: Biggest ko here
Ten: ’The torriroty black got are big, but no more influnce, and from his play, u will c, he is poor at battle, and, within whites terrority, black hardly get anything more. Just watch to c the reuslt.’
Ten: cnp, 14 kyu
]
(;B[ea]
C[tymak: would be playable now A10 and going out play as ko threat?...D10 feels slow
Ten: (Though he was then 9d when I checked a few months later)
Kawabata: lol
martin97: sounds good
martin97: ah well thats a twist
]
(;W[fa]
(;B[da]
(;W[fb]
C[martin97: and you saved his comment for years? nice
Ten: It left me such a deep impression that I still remember it
Badukness05: bent 4
dacat1: xD
Daniug: why playthis if still bent 4?
Ten: It’s not bent four
martin97: its not bent 4, its seki
StinkyTofu: when you come to the chat and see Ten commenting that without knowing the context xD
Ten: Hahaha
]
(;B[dj]
C[OndraKruml: arghghgh this hurts
]
(;W[ar]
C[Ten: Oh, really?  Ow the b8 stones can die
majobin: wow, this is european pro game ? 
Ten: *Now
StinkyTofu: Like this is a side of Antti I did not know about yet! xD
Zaphodian: It's bent 5 or 6
OndraKruml: I thought b was just gonna n16
Ten: Usually black should like to goad white into playing d10, yes
joris104: What's the time format ? Some sort of Fisher ?
tymak: btw, isnt b in trouble, if w connect H5?
Ten: Then fight the ko and live, +1 move
martin97: 45+20 fischer
joris104: ty
]
(;B[gg]
C[ys3: so take, right?
martin97: yeah this is strange sequence
dacat1: black soooort of survived?
OndraKruml: palko building  a ladder
dacat1: though this move is suspicious
Badukness05: we need AI professionals
ys3: no we dont
dacat1: seems more urgent to fix  h5 than to to help white on the outside like this....
You in mid air: w must play h14 now dont understand what he is thinking about
dacat1: I think he's considering h5...
OndraKruml: w can h5? isnt it geta?
Ten: That sounds like Ilya
dacat1: its not
martin97: isn't m4 sente to make it a geta
dacat1: [object Object\]
mcpudding: B4?
MatiasPankoke: seems like Palko was the one avoiding uncertainties in this fight. Weird. Why?
Chinitsu: R17 still in quarantine zone?
dacat1: m4 sente? I dont see it...
Ten: So at some point he thought he got what he wanted?
dacat1: maybe im misreading
Ten: I wonder what he wanted
Chinitsu: Maybe we need to wait 14 days
dacat1: i mean, it seems black survived, but the game shouldn't be good here
dacat1: playable if he fixes h5?
You in mid air: h14 right now is crucial no matter what
martin97: cant he still play k9 in your sequence, dacat?
You in mid air: just play h14 roln90
Free Tibet: Don't play solid and obvious roln90
Free Tibet: Go hardcore!
Badukness05: like in the old times of kgs
Free Tibet: Roln stong
SteamboatGoat: everyone talking about the good old kgs times... we got a bunch of dinosaurs in the chat :D
Badukness05: i remember javaness being 20kyu
dacat1: [object Object\]
martin97: thats when european go peaked :D
dacat1: i think white barely gets out in my variation, but g13 changes that
dacat1: ah wait even my move doesnt work
MatiasPankoke: Earlier, I prefered black actually
dacat1: nvm...
ys3: first time all game ilya has less time left
]
(;W[hf]
(;B[as]
C[Аlрhа - 1 5 2: You know it's baf when Ilya has less time.
]
(;W[ba]
C[Аlрhа - 1 5 2: *bad
SteamboatGoat: @dacat1 I think it' super cool when a move almost 10 spaces away affects a sequence (that isn't ladder)
martin97: [object Object\]
]
(;B[cb]
(;W[ar]
C[samqu: roln seems to play very well
]
(;B[gf]
C[Free Tibet: SteamboatGoat, 100% this
]
(;W[ge]
(;B[as]
(;W[ij]
C[terepy: that just sounds like a ladder with extra steps
samqu: you mean he is AI ?
]
(;B[il]
(;W[ar]
C[Аlрhа - 1 5 2: It's funny how all threats only count untill a10.
]
(;B[id]
C[Badukness05: wow
]
(;W[bp]
C[cephm: finally
]
(;B[he]
C[samqu: game is over
cephm: I can sleep now
ys3: if i owned a go server, people who say that game is over or someone should resign would be kicked out of room and not allowed to return because they dont need to see game anymore
ys3: but yes that ko lasted about 1 1/2 hours
Yvmores: It seems pretty dismal. But it isn't over till it's over.
martin97: game over is an estimation of the position, no?
Yvmores: Yeah
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: Isn't a17 another posible ko though?
Harleqin: Who do you think is ahead?
Yvmores: I think white is ahead. But black might have fighting chances
Free Tibet: W + 12
ys3: it snot an estimation, its a declaration that one side should resign
denisweber90: nice bot estimation free tibet
ys3: so they dont need ot watch game anymre, right?
]
(;W[jf]
C[mikach27: W has more cash, but B can gain alot after H15
Free Tibet: I always count myself
denisweber90: you count +12 at this board? you must be 9p+ lvl
terepy: I thought a17 just kills black? no ko
ys3: top left is seki
Free Tibet: Territorywise W~40 B ~28
Jr4yA: [object Object\]
]
(;B[ke]
C[Badukness05: 5th line move 
ys3: hes pushing around the middle white stones a bit
ys3: maybe make some point son top
Free Tibet: And I counted upper left as b's
Yvmores: L15 seems like a nice move. 
]
(;W[je]
C[Аlрhа - 1 5 2: [object Object\]
]
(;B[jd]
(;W[kd]
C[ys3: [object Object\]
martin97: stop playing after 3
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: Ooh. True.
ys3: and truthfully, with the state of the white group, w may not want to play there even later in game if he needs that eye
]
(;B[kc]
(;W[ld]
(;B[lc]
(;W[md]
C[tekken8: wait
tekken8: is black 'Cheater' from KGS?
ys3: yep
tekken8: huh
Badukness05: he is mitani kun
]
(;B[nb]
C[terepy: why o18 instead of o17?
]
(;W[ee]
C[Аlрhа - 1 5 2: 'Cheater'? Was it a username or is there a story behind?
Yvmores: o18 leaves less aji I believe
ys3: o17 has too many cuts
ys3: his kgs username is cheater
TramTram: user name
tekken8: ofc username
Free Tibet: occupation
tekken8: dunno why he put it
]
(;B[eg]
C[joris104: E13 looks painful
joris104: Having to play that
]
(;W[nc]
(;B[ob]
(;W[jl]
(;B[jm]
(;W[ik]
C[Free Tibet: Most popular KGS kibitz topics was rank systems comparison and score estimation
]
(;B[hl]
(;W[km]
C[Free Tibet: Like who's stronger a 1p or KGS 9d
]
(;B[in]
(;W[jn]
(;B[im]
C[Sampi: its basically the same
Free Tibet: 2hrs of kibitz
]
(;W[kk]
C[BoykoGoranov: ooooh bloody game
]
(;B[kf]
(;W[kg]
(;B[lf]
C[Badukness05: lol b
Free Tibet: And chess! KGS loved and hated chess at same time
Badukness05: and ofc bigdoug
denisweber90: There once was a browser based go server that display nyan cats all over your screen once you talked about another go server
]
(;W[lg]
C[Free Tibet: Finally we have the only server
]
(;B[mf]
(;W[qd]
C[DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: 46,5 W, 45 B with the points on the corner at b19 included...
]
(;B[pd]
(;W[pe]
C[Badukness05: is l14 overplay?
]
(;B[od]
C[denisweber90: [object Object\]
Sampi: S17?
Sampi: maybe not
]
(;W[qe]
(;B[mg]
(;W[rc]
(;B[qb]
(;W[qh]
(;B[pg]
(;W[qg]
(;B[mh]
(;W[li]
(;B[gc]
C[Badukness05: insane moves
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: badukness, will black win easy ?
DioBrandof923b297a6cf40dc: =)
Badukness05: very ezy
Badukness05: :)
kusrabs: White can tenuki now, right? There're alive at top?
ys3: also protects against the top left seki
ys3: no tenuki
roentgenium: I think White only has one eye at B14 if they tenuki
Yvmores: They need another move. Stuck between a bad spot & seki
ys3: if w just had one eye through here, he cant play a17 for seki later, since he would loaw b1 eye
ys3: so this would gain that too
ys3: lose*
ys3: b14 *
Аlрhа - 1 5 2: So, is g17 tesuji?
ys3: big endgame more like
Ten: This time situation is getting really exciting
]
(;W[hb]
(;B[hc]
C[whps40506: f16 ?
]
(;W[gb]
C[Free Tibet: F16
Badukness05: f16
cephm: still can cut at E17
Zaphodian: H18 was really smart again.
cephm: *can't
]
(;B[qk]
(;W[ib]
(;B[jb]
C[Zaphodian: B feels like playing at J18 but it would not be sente
marcjegoupro: byo yomi
]
(;W[qm]
C[marcjegoupro: Ilya has a lot to play in the center
MuYu: The Time is Fischer
hitchwigo: wouldnt h18 be sente if b exchanges f17 first ?
roentgenium: Silly question regarding the situation at A17 - would it not be a capturing race (and only a localised seki)
marcjegoupro: yes fishe time count second per moves
hitchwigo: j18 sry
]
(;B[nj]
C[Free Tibet: w 57 b 54
marcjegoupro: q9? for white
]
(;W[rn]
(;B[ro]
C[ys3: [object Object\]
Ten: I get white slightly ahead on the board, and then there’s komi to boot
]
(;W[ol]
C[Ten: Tough game for black, then
Free Tibet: Do you count, Ten?
marcjegoupro: yes white ahead if he take points in the center
]
(;B[ok]
C[ys3: he wrote a book about counting
Free Tibet: Lol
ys3: "rational endgame" i think its called
Free Tibet: I mean are you counting :)
Badukness05: man 
marcjegoupro: disputed tournament
Ten: Here I thought I just shared the result of my counting :D
]
(;W[rj]
(;B[rk]
C[gray1892: what about n8?
marcjegoupro: bib points down there for white
Free Tibet: It differs so much with mine
Sampi: i'm always couting other people's games, I never have time on my own
Free Tibet: I ususally count before resign
marcjegoupro: yes with fisher time you cannot count very well
]
(;W[nl]
C[kusrabs: somebody say Ilia there's 2 second gap with internet!
]
(;B[ri]
(;W[qi]
(;B[qj]
(;W[rh]
(;B[sj]
(;W[rb]
C[Ten: Oh, it would be a disaster if the phantom OGS time bug came up in this game
marcjegoupro: haha what phantom ?
Badukness05: phantom frm super metroid
Ten: Two games in the tournament were already lost on time because of the server’s issue
]
(;B[pr]
(;W[or]
(;B[qs]
(;W[pc]
C[Ten: Players playing the moves in time but the server not registering them
marcjegoupro: oh :(
]
(;B[oc]
(;W[qa]
(;B[pb]
(;W[kn]
(;B[lp]
(;W[mq]
C[ManyBears: I can't count but w+15?
Ten: Not that much for sure, I predict 5.5
marcjegoupro: no it will be very close
Badukness05: now even a kyu can win this game
Free Tibet: w 59
]
(;B[er]
C[marcjegoupro: yes white win
Free Tibet: b58
]
(;W[hs]
(;B[is]
(;W[js]
C[ys3: i would think ten could beat a kyu as black fom here
]
(;B[gr]
C[Ten: Hm... depends on the kyu
ManyBears: my count was assuming black takes top left, no seki, to be fair
Zaphodian: You might be surprised to hear that a kyu player often loses 20-30 points in the endgame, compared to a pro.
Ten: I don’t think there’s enough space to beat a 1k
]
(;W[jo]
(;B[ho]
(;W[mj]
(;B[mi]
C[Free Tibet: N10 is astronomically huge
]
(;W[lj]
C[ys3: w probabyl wont get top left seki
]
(;B[ln]
C[Ten: Huh, seems I was too optimistic for black, it’s going to be more than komi
Ten: White’s getting n10 did give white a few extra though
marcjegoupro: yes white win
CarloTibaldi: Isn't B K13 hurting?
Sampi: J14 has the same effect
Ten: So more like 9.5 then
kusrabs: I think White will lose.
]
(;W[nk]
C[Free Tibet: Place a bet then
]
(;B[pl]
(;W[pm]
C[kusrabs: This relaxes me when 10 seconds stays for a move
Sampi: white will win for sure
]
(;B[oi]
(;W[lo]
(;B[mo]
(;W[ko]
C[Ten: Ok, that’s again a wider lead for white
]
(;B[mp]
(;W[mn]
C[roentgenium: Was M6 a "hope" move for Black?
]
(;B[hh]
C[wxh100: [object Object\]
]
(;W[ih]
(;B[lh]
(;W[kh]
(;B[if]
(;W[ig]
(;B[ie]
(;W[jg]
(;B[fc]
(;W[ic]
C[Ten: Uh... 13.5 now?
Free Tibet: Lol ragequit
]
(;B[jc]
(;W[ec]
C[Palko: thank you
Sampi: now k19 is huge for w
marcjegoupro: big score for white now
Ten: Just turned into a kind of sente endgame, yeah
cephm: F16 lets W plays the seki again
Badukness05: gg
kusrabs: Ура!
kusrabs: gg
ManyBears: gg
BoykoGoranov: great game by ilya
kusrabs: Поздравляем с выходом в финал!
robertmehl: gg
mathbatler: Ура!
kusrabs: Perfect series, Pavol!
Ten: Got to love KataGo for verifying the endgame calculations, this is the future
Daniug: gg
Free Tibet: Have you heard of Alphago, Ten?
Meneghino: Поздравляю!
Michaelz: Крутая игра
Lennonson: I love watching you play, Pavol. Nobody makes me think about the game more, or with such fresh ideas.
LVL79: Поздравляю!!!
Lennonson: Also an amazing game from Ilya.
Daniug: when will it be the next game?
dacat1: Lukas podpera and Ali jabarin will play at 15:00 i think
dacat1: loser's bracket (5-8 place)
Daniug: thx
serglex: [object Object\]
]
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