Becoming 9 Kyu - Lesson 35

Move 8

Black[2d]

0 captures

White[2d]

0 captures

+ 6.5

Unranked

Rules: Japanese

Review by: ...

Move 0 + 8

December 7, 2019

[15:59] marianadi.mincu[2k]: hi all

[15:59] HamOfTruth[4k]: Hello

[15:59] Daimo[6k]: 👋🏼

Move 0 + 16

[16:05] Secretuse[2d]: I would agree i white would have stone at C7 instead o C6. As I see it, blak has no weakpoints, while white has several bad ajis.

[16:05] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: agreed with secretuse

[16:06] jmdingess[4d]: Black is overconcentrated everywhere

[16:06] Daimo[6k]: It’s a poor ratio of points to stones for black

[16:06] mark5000[7d]: That's the thing: it's too easy to fall into this mindset thinking the tight extensions are ok. This kind of thinking, mistaking the bad for the good, is really frightening.

[16:06] Secretuse[2d]: It is better to be safely overconcentrated, than having thinposition with bad aji.

[16:07] mark5000[7d]: To improve, you have to understand why good is good.

[16:07] Daimo[6k]: Do wide extensions result in lower total points because all territories are smaller?

[16:08] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: so what if i move black to say C13?

[16:08] Secretuse[2d]: I find C6 to be overplay.

Move 0 + 18

[16:08] marianadi.mincu[2k]: live .

[16:09] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: what if white play C15 instead?

Move 0 + 18

[16:09] marianadi.mincu[2k]: C16

[16:09] mark5000[7d]: C15 is over-concentrated

[16:09] marianadi.mincu[2k]: better

[16:09] Daimo[6k]: And slow

Move 0 + 22

[16:11] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: i see

Move 0 + 18

[16:11] jillgoodgal[8k]: it seems the key is to learn how far to extend without creating two weak groups anywhere

Move 0 + 18

[16:12] mark5000[7d]: Right

[16:12] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: and if I respond to F13 for black?

[16:12] mark5000[7d]: In this case, White has weaknesses, but White's play is also much more efficient than Black's

Move 0 + 20

[16:13] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: why not F11?

Move 0 + 18

[16:13] jillgoodgal[8k]: C6 seems the only real white weakness right now?

Move 0 + 20

[16:14] jmdingess[4d]: choice of E10, E11, F11 is just how much you want to defent the aji of C8 later while attacking

[16:14] jmdingess[4d]: but black is not accomplishing anything with C13 or F13

[16:14] jmdingess[4d]: the stones dont to anything

[16:14] mark5000[7d]: Perhaps. But Black has a weak group running for its life. Black can't take time out now to attack any weakness White has.

[16:15] mark5000[7d]: In any case, I want to get back to efficiency.

Move 0 + 25

[16:19] Daimo[6k]: Isn’t part of the problem that black has no corner enclosure to support a wide extension?

[16:20] mark5000[7d]: Yes

[16:20] marianadi.mincu[2k]: pincer R13

[16:20] itsuone[4k]: R12 attack

[16:20] Daimo[6k]: R12!

[16:20] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: attack it!

[16:21] jillgoodgal[8k]: or even R14 approach

[16:21] mark5000[7d]: You can think about it either way: Extensions are poor choices without enclosing first. And why is this so? Because you leave nice attacks for your opponent.

Move 0 + 28

[16:22] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: follow it :3

Move 0 + 30

[16:22] jillgoodgal[8k]: yes hit that corner!

[16:24] jaden.hacking[16k]: thx for review

Move 0 + 28

[16:25] jillgoodgal[8k]: so black should play something like R13 extension?

Move 0 + 25

[16:27] Shekomaru[5k]: Thanks a lot Mark :)

[16:27] mark5000[7d]: Does anyone want me to go back and explain the first principle more?

[16:27] orplus[4k]: yes

[16:27] mark5000[7d]: I'm happy to look at other patterns or answer any extension efficiency questions you have

Move 0 + 30

[16:27] jillgoodgal[8k]: extend long on an empty board, extend more carefully towards thickness?

Move 0 + 13

[16:27] mark5000[7d]: Yes!

Move 0 + 14

[16:28] mark5000[7d]: There was a question about this move

Move 0 + 16

[16:28] mark5000[7d]: I suppose people worry about this invasion point

[16:29] mark5000[7d]: Does anybody know how to make mischief here?

[16:29] mark5000[7d]: There's a trick for leaning on the corner to build power for a counter attack.

Move 0 + 30

[16:29] jillgoodgal[8k]: I would just kick as black then try to secure the corner

Move 0 + 16

[16:29] VincentSalsero[4k]: C3 ?

[16:29] Daimo[6k]: D7?

[16:30] Shekomaru[5k]: E10?

[16:30] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: E10

[16:30] marianadi.mincu[2k]: B8

[16:30] orplus[4k]: b6

[16:30] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: E10 or E6

[16:30] mark5000[7d]: E10 is good. But it's a sacrificial tactic. If you play it, it's fine. But I'm looking more at activating C6 right away

[16:30] Shekomaru[5k]: B4?

[16:30] Secretuse[2d]: I think, it is better to attak thsi position indiretly with C12 instead o C8.

[16:31] mark5000[7d]: Ah, ok

[16:31] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: E4?

Move 0 + 25

[16:31] jillgoodgal[8k]: sorry where are we at on the positions?

Move 0 + 16

[16:31] mark5000[7d]: I realize you're 3 kyu and above the level of this lecture, but it looks like there's enough interest

[16:31] mark5000[7d]: Click sync.

[16:31] Daimo[6k]: I like the drop by one

Move 0 + 16

[16:32] jillgoodgal[8k]: the book suggests pressing down against the third line

Move 0 + 20

[16:33] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: why you dont move to C5?

[16:34] mark5000[7d]: C5 is good too

Move 0 + 22

[16:37] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: i see

[16:37] mark5000[7d]: One point about efficiency: it may not seem like an advantage at the time, but finding the right balance between loose and tight in the opening can pay off in territory later.

Move 0 + 14

[16:37] jillgoodgal[8k]: two weak black groups, only one weak white group

[16:38] mark5000[7d]: So Black isn't well served by invading there now.

Move 0 + 14

[16:38] mark5000[7d]: If the invasion doesn't work that well, then White needn't settle for just this one

[16:38] mark5000[7d]: Although it's also fine.

Move 0 + 19

[16:38] mark5000[7d]: Modern players would probably attach like this.

[16:39] mark5000[7d]: It's a third choice

Move 0 + 13

[16:39] mark5000[7d]: ABC are all fine

Move 0 + 15

[16:44] mark5000[7d]: So this invasion isn't too bad now.

Move 0 + 17

[16:45] jillgoodgal[8k]: but the start of a base maybe means black only needs one eye in the center instead of two

Move 0 + 15

[16:45] mark5000[7d]: If you make large frameworks like this, it's worth learning tactics like this to convert it into profit later.

[16:45] mark5000[7d]: And yes

[16:45] mark5000[7d]: Black gained something. But White gained more.

[16:46] mark5000[7d]: That's the spirit of Go

[16:46] mark5000[7d]: Making small gains through the placement of stones, and those gains build up and turn into more points at scoring. Then you win.

[16:47] Secretuse[2d]: I think, pushing one more extra move at G11 is not good, I would rather jump at F9

Move 0 + 25

[16:48] mark5000[7d]: You think?

Move 0 + 26

[16:48] mark5000[7d]: I'd be happy to jump up. It looks like White is still attacking Black.

Move 0 + 27

[16:48] mark5000[7d]: Black would need another move around here anyway

Move 0 + 28

[16:49] Secretuse[2d]: I simply do not like pushin from behind unless it is really necessary

[16:49] mark5000[7d]: THen White has a few choices, including here.

[16:49] mark5000[7d]: Ok

[16:50] mark5000[7d]: I hear that pushing from behind is bad surprisingly often.

[16:50] jillgoodgal[8k]: Opening Theory Made Easy

[16:51] mark5000[7d]: Oh, is it Hideo Otake's principle?

[16:51] Secretuse[2d]: Also I would rather play G6 instead of H10

[16:51] jillgoodgal[8k]: yes, along with extend at any cost

[16:51] mark5000[7d]: That would make sense why I hear it so much

[16:51] jillgoodgal[8k]: he would love your white extension

Move 0 + 30

[16:52] mark5000[7d]: Looks like we're playing a game now

[16:53] mark5000[7d]: Yeah, this could happen. If you ask me, I'd happily take White.

[16:53] Secretuse[2d]: I am sorry for interrupting. I did nto mean to play a game with you during lesson

[16:53] mark5000[7d]: Does anyone have another question about extensions?

[16:54] mark5000[7d]: And don't worry! I thought some people find this interesting. You have to know how to play after the opening too

Move 0 + 9

[16:54] jillgoodgal[8k]: this is a good situation for a question, what best now, move into center right, or extend out on the bottom?

Move 0 + 13

[16:55] jillgoodgal[8k]: from the final earlier position I meant

Move 0 + 30

[16:55] mark5000[7d]: Here?

Move 0 + 18

[16:56] jillgoodgal[8k]: no when you were discussing how far to push with black and black moved downwards

[16:56] jillgoodgal[8k]: there was a large white moyo upper left

Move 0 + 17

[16:57] jillgoodgal[8k]: so I wondered, which is more key, the center right or the open lower part

Move 0 + 28

[16:57] jillgoodgal[8k]: yes from here

[16:58] mark5000[7d]: The upper side is the most important.

[16:58] jillgoodgal[8k]: I would probably choose extension along the bottom, good thing I asked!

[16:58] mark5000[7d]: White is building a huge framework there.

Move 0 + 29

[16:58] mark5000[7d]: As Black, it's worth reducing it any way you can. Now, while you still can.

Move 0 + 29

[16:59] mark5000[7d]: Shoulder hit is also nice.

[16:59] mark5000[7d]: Go deeper at your peril

Move 0 + 28

[16:59] mark5000[7d]: Any other questions?

Move 0 + 29

[17:00] jillgoodgal[8k]: thank you so much!

Move 0 + 8

[17:00] mark5000[7d]: You're welcome!

[17:00] mark5000[7d]: Thanks for watching

[17:00] mark5000[7d]: Remember the two principles of extending!

[17:01] Binikumontoksusunya[4k]: thanks mark

[17:01] marianadi.mincu[2k]: thx

[17:01] Muzungu[4k]: thank you !

[17:01] orplus[4k]: thank you

[17:02] mark5000[7d]: Find past lectures here: becoming 9-kyu-a-series-for-beginners